EVERY YEAR, thousands of people from around the world descend on an American
city to spend the weekend discussing everything from bubble wrap to
counterfeit goods and the Russian mafia at eBay Live, the online auction
giant’s annual jamboree.
The get-together has always been a fun affair, with silly hats and jokey
T-shirts, but there was never any disguising that eBay is a serious
business. With 233m customers worldwide, the world’s largest online retailer
sold $60 billion (£30 billion) of goods last year.
A car gets sold on eBay every minute, a music player every 16 seconds.
Thousands make a full-time living buying and selling on eBay - African
villagers are sending their children to school on money they make by selling
goods on the site. By any measure, eBay is one of the great successes of the
internet age. So why were these people booing?
This year’s conference took place in Chicago and was the most controversial in
the seven-year history of eBay Live.
The company had been expecting 10,000 people. It looked like half that number
had turned up and the exhibitors’ hall seemed to have been reshuffled to
hide the gaps.
Many people walked out when eBay chief executive John Donahoe took the stage
to make his keynote address. His predecessor, Meg Whitman, used to get
rock-star treatment, mobbed by fans on the floor. But at least the crowd was
polite to Donahoe. They booed his No 2, Lorrie Norrington, president of eBay
Marketplaces, the company’s core auctions business.
After introducing some controversial and unpopular changes, the pair knew they
needed to do some schmoozing. Donahoe showed pictures of himself as a child;
he even introduced his parents. Norrington told everyone how well they were
doing. But for all the buttering up, the crowd turned nasty as Norrington
began explaining the changes.
In the past six months a storm of protest has howled from America to Britain
to Australia over radical changes to fees and the way items are listed and
paid for on eBay.
The move that triggered the most boos concerns the way buyers and sellers rate
their transactions. It was one of the unique characteristics of eBay that
both buyer and seller would rate their transaction. The idea was to build a
community of trust where both parties knew - by reputation - who they were
dealing with even if they were separated by thousands of miles. Now eBay
sellers are up in arms over a change that means they can leave only positive
feedback for buyers.
“For the past dozen years we together have built one of the most unique
businesses and we have done it through trust,” said Norrington. “Building
trust is a priority for us and it should be for you too. But some of our
users have developed bad habits.”
Leaving “retaliatory feedback” for buyers was driving away business and was
not acceptable, she said.
The boos began. “Bring it on - we love it. Tell us how you feel,” she said
gamely.
The eBay community is certainly doing that - on eBay’s chat boards, their own
websites and any place they can get themselves heard.
Elaine Bennett Scheib is one of an army of small eBay sellers who believe the
company has used them to build up its business and now wants to dump them to
make way for much bigger fish.
For the past nine years the self-described “stay at home mom” has sold her
paintings and drawings of fairies and other cutesy beings through eBay. She
has a 100% positive record, meaning every one of her customers was happy
with the business they did with her.
“You’re the greatest, thank you,” wrote one recent customer. Another wrote: “I
love this fat fairy.”
Happy fairies, happy customers. The only one who isn’t happy is Bennett
Scheib. She thinks eBay is trying to drive her out of business. “They are
rude and arrogant,” she said. “They want me gone as quickly as possible.”
She is one of a growing band of angry eBay sellers who started boycotting the
firm from May 1. Some are defecting to other sites or going it alone. Others
have even begun lobbying Google in the hope it will launch a rival. If there
was a big enough rival to eBay out there already, the exodus would “blow
their doors off”, said Bennett Scheib.
Not everyone is unhappy. Chris Dawson, author of the Tamebay.com eBay blog,
described this eBay Live as the most professional he had attended. “They are
doing a number of things that they had to do,” he said. “Good sellers will
change. It may be painful but they will do it.”
Dawson said eBay now faces more competition in a world where expectations for
online shopping have risen rapidly. “eBay can’t just stand still. But it
does seem to be trying to do a lot of things at once,” he said. “There are
reasons why eBay is changing and they are unlikely to stop. Boos or no boos.”
Donahoe said he wanted the company to operate less like a car-boot sale and
more like a shopping mall. Most eBay sales are auctions, with bidders vying
to secure what’s on offer, but the company has been growing the number of
goods its sells at a fixed price. Fixed-price sales accounted for 42% of the
total in the last three months of 2007.
To speed up the gentrification, eBay has started offering discounts for big
sellers and changes in its search process that favour them with good
feedback.
It’s not just small sellers who are finding the new system frustrating. Bruce
Hershenson, boss of Emovieposter.com, a vintage-cinema memorabilia company,
has sold more than $13m of goods on eBay since he signed up in 1998. He
recently quit eBay for good and is dedicating his efforts to his own website.
The recent price changes will result in his fees going up 40% annually and, he
said, eBay wants to ditch people dealing in “vintage” items in favour of
those selling new goods.
Norrington denied that this was eBay’s intention. She said good sellers had
nothing to fear. “Our goal is to bring buyers and sellers together in the
safest way,” she said. “The internet is continually evolving. It’s all about
staying focused on our customer.”
As far as Hershenson is concerned, that customer isn’t him. “Normally I can
understand business situations like this,” he said. “I might not agree with
them but I understand. But this I don’t get at all. They are just trying to
copy Amazon.”
And well they might, said Jeffrey Lindsay, analyst at Sanford Bernstein. He
felt eBay had to change or die. “Our view is that management have about a
year to turn this company round,” said Lindsay.
eBay posted a 22% jump in first-quarter profits, boosted in large part by the
performance of Paypal, its online-payment system, international sales and
the weak dollar. But growth in active users at eBay’s core business was
almost flat and the number of new listings was up only 4% from the previous
quarter.
Its core business is growing at about 9% year on year, said Lindsay, about
half the rate of the e-commerce market in general. Amazon is growing at 32%
a year and positioning itself as an alternative to eBay.
“Amazon has superior customer service and almost zero fraud,” said Lindsay.
“eBay has seller fraud and counterfeit-goods problems.
“As the internet matures, its audience expect more and eBay has to make its
sellers deliver.
“This is the first time in five years that they have addressed eBay’s core
problems. The real question is, have they left it too late?”
A lengthy critical analysis of hidden IDs and shill bidding on eBay at:
http://www.auctionbytes.com/forum/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=6498345#6498345
PhilipCohen, Sydney, Australia
I have ben selling for over a year with eBay. However recent and hugely unpopular changes to the Feedback system and search facilities have driven my customer base away. I have moved 95% of my listings to Specialist Auctions .com
Martin, Huntingdon,
The Retaliatory Feedback issue is a Red Herring. Sellers would rather leav no feedback with a bad buyer. If the Seller gets a Negative first, he has nothig to lose by telling the truth.
Negatives have never hurt Buyers really, but Sellers feel it much more. Ebay misunterpeted the data.
Peter Combs, Gloucester, USA
Policy changes by eBay are fast alienating the loyal core of auction sellers. Buyers visit eBay for a BARGAIN, and for the thrill of a gamble/competition. There are many better fixed price specialist websites out there . Wise up eBay before it is too late. We shall miss you when you're gone.
Michael Gardner, Gillingham, England
I have been selling on eBay for 8 years. It has changed completely since then . The new policies are not fair to sellers. without sellers eBay will have no business. I have found a good alternative - I have moved to groovycart.co.uk and set up my own shop.
Jill , Aylesbury, UK
eBAy do please end this madness about feedback, police it & earn your money.
If I sell something & the buyer don't pay or respond they should get neutral or negative if appropriate.
There are probably MORE dodgy BUYERS using Ebay than there are dodgy sellers, this need to be an even
platform
James, Edinburgh, Scotland
eBay's management have clearly lost the plot on so many fronts. I used to be a shareholder in eBay and afterwards ran a small eBay shop. In the last 2 years, there has been a string of ill-thought out changes, which have damaged not just one type of seller, but lots. Great company gone bad!!!
Pete, London,
ebay are imo only interested in profits and not caring about genuine sellers & buyers
Then I found eBid dot net. This shown me what real customer service is and how friendly forums can be, especially when you cannot hide behind posting id's on eBid
My raindropsies stores are OK with no fees to pay
Sarah Jones, Nottingham, England
Well done Mr Rushe - you really caught the mood here. EBay used to be the best community on the web and they are ruining it.
James, New York, USA
My sister sold hundreds of items here in the states. a competitor used several accounts to leave her neutrals and one star ratings over the course of 6 months. We called all of the accounts and found out the telephones were disconnected. Can't wait for Google Bay.
Paul, Hawaii, USA
eBay has problem with fraud and counterfeit & they are under great pressure to stop these crimes, so with respect to the good sellers, things have had to change & the un-policeable good times have now gone!
eBay have had to put their house in legal order to make it safe, they have had to "grow up"!
Jake Rivers, Crewe, England
The biggest clincher for me was not the new feedback nor the fee restructuring, but the fact that I was to be forced into offering PayPal. Later, the other factors just confirmed that I was doing the right thing, and the Community Forums read like a horror novel at times! Read www.paypalsucks.com.
Jonathan, Scarborough,
I have been with the bay for a number of years, the changes are forcing many of us out. I have now moved most of my listings to eBid, it's a pleasure to sell on there. No listing fees, free gallery with a very small charge if the item sells and great customer liason/service. eBid is growing strong.
Denise, Westmidlands, UK
I'm a "small seller" who listed from 75 to 100 books per week since 2002, usually selling for from .99 to $5 in the auction format. I've received over 12,000 positive feedbacks. I hated to do it, but the feedback changes, Paypal hold changes, etc. forced me to quit April 10. Michael O'Neal Albany GA
Michael, Albany, USA
Just talking to a friend who payed by paypal for a tractor which she bought through EBAY they told her it would take 21 days for the payment to clear and in the meantime held her money on deposit, they get 2.5% + interest on any money paid what a rip off shouldnt be allowed
Joseph Schwartz, London, UK
I am not happy about having to use Paypal as a method of payment. I much prefer cheques or postal orders. I think it time I got all the listings on and ended it. Have looked at Ebid but nothing seems to sell on there. Sue
Sue J, Crewe, Cheshire
Let's not forget one of the outstanding changes: under certain circumstances, PayPal will hold money paid by a buyer up to 21 days before giving it to the seller. I believe PayPal will require proof of delivery to the buyer or possibly, even more egregious, positive feedback given to the seller.
B Carle, Dallas, USA
Two golden rules of Selling:
1. The Customer is always Right
2. If the Customer is wrong, refer to Rule 1
The feedback system had becomer a farce as buyers were scared stiff to leave any realistic frustations for fear of retaliatory feedback. Average sellers' feedback over 98% positive ? hmmm
Rick, Ilkley, W Yorkshire
ebay is dead duck, look at the negative feeback forums. Not only are power sellers quitting, but a lot of us were also buyers!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sellers are turning to the BBB, class action suits, media, politicians, dedicated websites and anything they can think ;
Jean-Francois Galy, Paris, France
I sold on eBay for four years and had 100% positive feedback. I left because of their bad customer service and changes. It was suddenly a dictatorship I was not in control of my own business. Not being able to leave a negative leaves sellers open to abuse. eBid.net provides a good alternative.
Becky, Bath, UK
Having been with Ebay for 4 years, I feel this time they have made too many changes in too short a time.
I have closed my shop and now only list a very limited number of items. My main trade is now on Ebid.net.
Marianne, Buckingham, UK
Ebay are now in serious trouble and I doubt that they will ever recover from this fiasco, this latest raft of ill thought changes is the final straw. The alternative site where you can use Google Checkout ebid.net seems to be the natural home for many, their forums are awash with ex ebayers.
Ken, Hampshire, UK
Ebid may have lots of things for sale, just a pity it did not have as many buyers.I tried it but sold nothing in the whole time I was listing on there.
Shame though, ebay are getting too big for their boots.
I thought maybe someone like, Branson, Gates or the like would take them on as they can.
Rik Jones, Liskeard, UK
like many I am both a seller and buyer on ebay. I have been stung by the ever increasing fees and also by counterfeit goods, I also have been stung by buyers returning empty packages. Ebid is just a newer version of ebay as it has all of ebays counterfeit sellers appearing on it, so ebid is no bette
graham, Richmond, Surrey
Ebay used to be a great place to find vintage and one of kind products. I used tell people about Ebay. People can't find great deals on Ebay any longer because sellers are charged high fees which is passed on to the consumer now. Ebay soon will no longer be an icon in pop culture.
TR, Syracuse, USA
I sold a lot of stuff on ebay but recently I've had buyers fraudulently claim that goods had arrived damaged (never happened before in 7 years of trading!) and forced refunds from me. Ebay gave me no support or protection. And Paypal charges have gone up. I've dropped ebay for good now.
Jonathon Smeeton, London,
ebay are a joke i have been burnt as a seller receiving empty boxes back and as a buyer getting counterfeits supplied. Whilst ebay may be suspending some bad sellers they are appearing on ebid with open arms. Ebid owns pppay just like ebay own paypal so all is just as bad as one another, not good
graham, Richmond, Surrey
ebay are a joke ,
now they think they are a shopping mall with so much chinese rubbish being sold which is utter rubbish it`s cluttered full of this stuff , gone are the days of finding that single trading card you need or that piece of pottery ,
move to ebid.net
merlin, midlands, u.k.
Since all these changes have been implemented, both sellers and buyers are reluctant to list or bid.
Hidden IDs are a haven for shill bidding and as a result buyers are holding off until the last few seconds of an auction before placing a bid.
The whole thing is a joke now. No confidence in them.
Margaret, Plymouth, England
Well folks...there is an alternative to Ebay...and that is EBID.
I have been a seller on Ebay for almost 5 years but cannot afford to be there any longer. As previous writer stated, EBID is how Ebay used to be, only better...before Ebay became too greedy.
Barrattess, Lincoln, England
I saw in the article that people want a good alternative to Ebay, well, there is one, and it is growing daily, EBID, as a small seller, ebay and paypal fees have forced me to stop listing there even though I have 408 positive feedback, no negative. I Ebid is the best auction site I know of.
L. Hudson, bradford, ENGLAND
The fun has gone out of eBay (I joined in 1998) and the fees - between the site and PayPal - have priced small sellers out. Lots of people going over to eBid now and finding it alot more like the early eBay days (but even less expensive). I've started over there and it is so much less stressful.
Kristi, Warrington, UK
I have never seen so many people in a up-roar about Ebay until now. Its kind of like walking down a dark alley in a bad nieghborhood at 1:00 AM. You have to constantly watch your back for scammer buyers. Ebay dropped us in that alley.
Christine, TN, USA
Every Ebay change is now making the experience worse for both buyers and sellers.
I suppose I am the 'hobby' seller (200 feedback) they don't want anymore as my net margin isn't satisfying their investors.
The broken search has now stopped me buying too
C'mon Mr Google, start an auction site!
Colin Soames, Londonistan,
Ebay's changes to feedback, increased selling fees, etc. are wonderful. They've given many people a superb earnings opportunity. As the price of eBay stock has steadily declined. many have sold SHORT or exercised PUT options to take advantage of eBay Management's ineptitude. Kudos to CEO Donahue.
Ted Cohen, Staten Island, NY, USA
Sellers are no longer even safe from buyers that they have "blocked" from bidding. Because users can have multiple user id's, retaliatory buyers with whom sellers have had negative experiences can leave vengeful feedback on a sellers page for no ligitimate reason with no consequences!
Brenda Wilder, Georgetown, USA
Ebay refused over the last few years to address the problem of bad sellers bullying buyers into leaving positive fback. The option left was to stop sellers leaving negs. Leaving good sellers unprotected & open to abuse & banning under seller non-performance. Madness, ebay in self-destruct mode.
Migsie, Newcastle Upon Tyne, England
amazon certainly has a fraud problem. When they introduced the "Create a Product Detail Page" and allowed users to upload images to supplement the amazon catalog they kicked open wide the door to counterfeiters in the DVD section.
KEA, los angeles, usa
Unequivocally, the most absurd element of the "New" paradiem, is the "Neutral=Negative" issue, wherein E-Bay is now lumping together "Neutral" FB with "Negative", retroactive for 12 months., thereby reducing Sellers Ratings, & disallowing Fee discounts. Even Buyers object to this!
Rita, The OC, USA
I sold on Ebay for 5 years, but quit due to the changes. I was listing 300 items per week. but I won't take the chance of being defrauded out of my items. I had two buyers claim their items arrived damaged and demand refunds without a return as soon as the changes took place too much stress
Adam, Gainesville,
Having been with eBay from the early days, it is sad to see what is happening. eBay is no longer just the 'venue' but is the Boss who's repeatedly disprespecting you and breathing down the back of your neck! All my motivation to work on eBay has disappeared. I do miss my customers though :(
Jayne, Burton, MI, USA
Ebay listings are NOT up. All those millions of listings, that you see with the lastest counts are all buy.coms. They brought them on at the exact time they knew sellers would be leaving.
BUY.com, lists for FREE, so those millions of listings, aren't bringing in any revenue. It's all a smokescreen
Tracy, Sykesville, USA
Ebay's Norrington has no credibility whatsever.
If one of Ebay's primary objectives is to build trust, they are going about it in a peculiar fashion.
The recently revised Feedback policy where 'Neutral' somehow now means 'Negative' creates just the opposite.
Ebay Sellers have no trust in Ebay.
John, Coleraine, USA
I would still be using eBay Australia, except of their forcing us to use paypal. I prefer using direct deposit. OK, they say it is safe, but the use of paypal still means they can post a brick. It just takes longer to get the money, giving them time to use my money. At least there is competition.
James, Albany, Australia
The feedback changes were ill thought out, and were rushed out into deployment without key features like feedback hub.
Currently buyers can 'win' auctions and attempt a fraudulent payment.It is difficult for sellers to act against the 'buyer',being held to ransom by unwarranted negs and suspension
Richardb, London, UK